Balanced Budget Bill

[Erik Mortis]

If I understand the tax law correctly, the government normally can take in 500EUR a month by taxing each Duchy 100EUR.

Meaning we have a budget of 500/month. Thus, with this number we can afford to spend, as a government 500/month, both in governmental function/bounties, and wages/salaries.

Ministries should pay bounties on things that influence them directly. So miltary things get paid by the MoMA..etc. In my view. However with New Cit bounties at 50, we have to figure out if they are accounted for in the budget? Here's some numbers to start us out.

Ministry Budgets:
MiniImNat: 70
MiniInfo: 40
MiniInt: 50
MoMA: 60
MiniTrade: 80

We now have 200 Left. Perhaps salaries?

Praetor: 15EUR
Arbiter: 10EUR
Assistant Arbiter: 5EUR
Steward: 10EUR
MiniImNat: 10EUR
MiniInfo: 5EUR
MiniInt: 15EUR
MoMA: 10EUR
MiniTrade: 15EUR

This leaves us with 105 Surplus, which we can use to augment the Crown Account. Since New Cit Bounties are payed from there, having a surplus feeding it will help pad it for those months when we get lots of cits at once, and for the Kaiser to be able to hand out rewards.

Any takers?

[Krasniy Yastreb]

Looks pretty damn good. The more money flowing around more places for more of the time, the more chance of people paying attention and participating in the economy as a whole.

[Erik Mortis]

I'm also thinking Hasam may have been right about making more erb. A little inflation might be a good thing to make people more willing to part with a few erb here and there. But that's another bill.

[Andreas the Wise]

If we have a budget of 80, are we still responsible for paying for culture bounties?

[Erik Mortis]

I suppose MiniInfo or MiniInt would take over Culture bounties. MiniTrade would just do economy related bounties.

[Malliki]

That way, the ministries would have to value each bounty in relation to its total budget.

[Andreas the Wise]

I note salaries are suddenly in there again. I thought we agreed salaries unfair?

Personally, I'm against a balanced budget. I think we should pay people when they do great cultural things, with a reference to similiar payments before (basically common law), and then tax when we need to. We shouldn't be forced to say "oh, nobody did anything much this month ... but have the 80 anyway, since we've got a budget" and the next month to say "ooh, you did great things there ... and you did great things there ... and you did awesome stuff there ... and you did amazing stuff there ... each have 20, because, sorry, we don't have anything more"

[Scott of Hyperborea]

I agree with Andreas. I thought we agreed salaries would be handled as a special case of bounties.

[Erik Mortis]

Then make more money so we can work with a larger budget. I'm suggesting we create something a bit more real and sensible out of this economy. Maybe tax more.

We need to get the money moving...

[Malliki]

The voting system isn't helping. Some people seem to feel reluctant to make inter duchy transactions in fear of weakening their vote in the LR.

[Erik Mortis]

This is a predicament...

[Malliki]

Yes. The voting system encourages people to hold on to their Erbs.

[Andreas the Wise]

Mike, what the voting system should do is encourage people to want to actually earn erb. I've had experience with the three major forms of micronational economy (vote, post and war). The problem with a post based economy is that even though theoretically the money is worth nothing and people should want to spend it accordingly ... they don't, because nobody actually wants to offer services to earn it. Where as here, people actually do want to earn it - and so when people (like me, for example) want a service, the others are quite happy to do it to earn erb. I'd personally be happy if all the economy did was transfer money between the government and those developing culture. At leasts its moving. But for Sakat's sake don't take away the tie to voting and the only thing making people want money ...

[Malliki]

I'm not saying that it should be taken away. I'm saying that the voting system, as it is now, is somewhat counter productive if we want the Erb to move. But generally, I think that this is the most successful economic system I've ever seen (not that I've seen that many).

[Erik Mortis]

I'm more and more thinking that more money will be the answer. If we can inflate the value of the erb to the point that we can comprehend what 1 erb is worth in our real lives, we'll be more willing to let go of erb, and to have an idea what a fair wage is. Also with more money we have more to work with. Right now we hoard erb because there is so little.

Erb as a commodity is scarce, if it was more common we would move it around more, not treat it so much like a commodity of rarity.

If we had more money, but left numbers as they are, I would have no more objects to things as they are. and it would change how I suggested working things out.

Salaries would become fair. Budgets would be large enough to make sense.

[Andreas the Wise]

10 000 maybe. 100 000 seems to make a single erb so worthless it loses its charm. So many economies deal in the 1000s to make a transaction worthwhile. I rather liked the fact that Shireroth's didn't ....

[Erik Mortis]

But we want an single erb to.. well.. not worthless... but worth less. We want people willing to spend an erb at the drop of a hat.

[Malliki]

Now I own 2.26% of the total amount of Erbs in the system. That makes me very reluctant to spend money. If it was .226% or .0226%, a couple of Erbs wouldn't make any difference.

[Oroigawa Koreyasu]

Oi! MiniEx!

[Erik Mortis]

DAMN! I knew I forgot something!

[Jess]

[Erik Mortis]

Okey. I still advise some sort of budget for salaries and wages and giving money to Ministries to pay out bounties with and stuff...

But forget all this balanced budget stuff.