Possible military action

[Scott Alexander]

Okay, so we're looking for something for our military to do when we're friendly with all other micronations and wouldn't want to attack them even if we weren't.Well, my computer was recently taken over by a scumware program. For those of you who don't know, this is something that gains access either via a stupid decision of yours or via a trojan and then does stuff like give you extra popup ads, change your homepage, randomly navigate you to a webpage it wants you to spend money at, et cetera - and then offer you a removal program for the low, low cost of $69.95. It also cooperates with other such programs to lower your security or let them all in, so my computer has about the same health level as the average citizen of downtown Calcutta right now. I ordered a program for $40 that should get rid of most of them, but I'm really irked because I shouldn't have to do that kind of thing.I say Shireroth declares war on scumware.Here's my plan. I know the websites of a lot of these companies. So we equip all of our soldiers with proxies and automatic reloaders, and every night, they just sit there and reload the webpage every five seconds. I calculate that'll be about 7000 reloads per night per soldier, so if we can get 10 soldiers going for two weeks, that's about a million page views. That should wreak havoc on their bandwidth and either take down their page or make them pay their web providers a whole lot more money, either one of which would be an acceptable alternative. I suspect this might not be technically legal, but I also don't think there's any way to catch us if we use the proxies well, not to mention that no jury on Earth would convict us.I am wondering what computer gurus like Ari think of this plan, whether it's feasible, whether it's too risky, or what. But right now, I am on the warpath against these people and it seems like as good a thing as anything else to do with our military.

[Phoenix the Risen]

Scott......I love you...*disclaimer*AGREED!!! We should totally do this!!!!!We'd be doing a service not only to a citizen of our nation, but to the entire online community. WE'D BE HEROES!!! W00t!So... where do we get these proxies and autoreloaders?If they're relatively silent, I could probably install them onto a few computers at my school as well, since I don't really have access at home as much anymore...Ari! Help usss!!! Phoenix the Risen - Dutchess of Kildare - Political Nuisance but at least She gets the job done. - Official Genkher of Gryphon Avocatio's Cool Short Sig and Gryphon the Pure's Awesome Tables! - COME BACK, STEVE!!! -"To quote a former Kaiser.... 'Shireroth doesn't give up land....'" ~UEC (Quoting Kaiser Letifer I), In response to claims on the Raynor Isles"To paraphrase a former Kaiser: 'Here! Take Amity for free! And that other half of Mar Sara too!'" ~SaiKar LumEth, (Paraphrasing Kaiser Mog I) In response to UEC"To paraphrase a former angry mob "DOWN WITH THE EVIL LAND-GIVING AWAY KAISER! REVOLT! REBELLION! CIVIL WAR!" ~Scott Siskind, (paraphrasing the Letifer Rebellion group) In response to SaiKar LumEth"I HEARBY QUESTION THE KAISERESS AUTHORITY!" ~Gryphon Avocado (Switching Day)

[Austi Scot]

Scott......I love you too ... *disclaimer*

[Scott Alexander]

For the auto-reloader, I was thinking [edit: just realized this should probably be classified. I'll mention it somewhere secret.]. If Ari knows of something that can reload every second instead of every five seconds...well then, we've just quintupled our firepower. As for proxies, if we decided to go through with this I'd have to find some good ones...probably we should make sure everyone has a different one so that it's coming from multiple directions. I'm just not sure whether a dedicated tracker would be able to find us despite the proxies or whether we'd be causing trouble to the proxy people and to our own networks as well as to the scumware providers. The all-wise Ari will have to clarify those points. Edited by: Scott Siskind  at: 3/13/04 4:31 am

[Phoenix the Risen]

Quick, to the S.E.P. ... or something like that... and we should probably archive the stuff in the SEP forum sometime so that we don't give away our old SEP's every time we come up with a new one with new people involved... et cetera... Phoenix the Risen - Dutchess of Kildare - Political Nuisance but at least She gets the job done. - Official Genkher of Gryphon Avocatio's Cool Short Sig and Gryphon the Pure's Awesome Tables! - COME BACK, STEVE!!! -"To quote a former Kaiser.... 'Shireroth doesn't give up land....'" ~UEC (Quoting Kaiser Letifer I), In response to claims on the Raynor Isles"To paraphrase a former Kaiser: 'Here! Take Amity for free! And that other half of Mar Sara too!'" ~SaiKar LumEth, (Paraphrasing Kaiser Mog I) In response to UEC"To paraphrase a former angry mob "DOWN WITH THE EVIL LAND-GIVING AWAY KAISER! REVOLT! REBELLION! CIVIL WAR!" ~Scott Siskind, (paraphrasing the Letifer Rebellion group) In response to SaiKar LumEth"I HEARBY QUESTION THE KAISERESS AUTHORITY!" ~Gryphon Avocado (Switching Day)

[Scott Alexander]

Okay, this forum is secure.The [classified] part is Opera. That browser has an auto-reload built in.My flight's leaving soon and I need to get going - could you give Ari access here and tell him to get over here to comment?

[Kaiser Wyltheow I]

I was actually infected by two of those recently...i got rid of one...can't get rid of the other...i think it is a fine plan... Wylþeow du GrifosThe Kaiser of ShirerothThe gods blessed you with power and a visionThe gods gave you life to accomplish a mission...

[Gman Russell]

I support this action and don't support it at the same time.1) Are they legitamate companies with scummy practices?2) If they find us out and sue us, they don't need a jury.I believe hell has a special level dedicated to hackers who make viruses just to annoy and be evil... but if these are legit companies with shady practices then we might not want to do this.There's also the chance it won't even affect them... but I digress; ARI!

[Scott Alexander]

Quote:I believe hell has a special level dedicated to hackers who make viruses just to annoy and be evilAccording to the latest map it's Level V, but yes, point taken. Can Ari get in here?

[Kaiser Wyltheow I]

I made a reply to this post yesterday, but my browser hicoughed and and i was forced to resend the page, and whenever I did that, the virus on my computer kept sending me to a site to make me search for things i don't care about. This is only two days after i removed one similar to which Scott speaks of.Scott, let me say that I do approve, but if legal action is brought against the nation I am holding you responsible. It is your crazy plot afterall. Also be wary of getting involved with hackers...they're a crazy bunch... Wylþeow du GrifosThe Kaiser of ShirerothThe gods blessed you with power and a visionThe gods gave you life to accomplish a mission...

[Erik Mortis]

indeed.. indeed.You have me.. and Alex. Yay for Firewalls.. that might help us. Denial of Service might be what we could be charged with. But I'm not sure. We could always counter sue them for infecting our computers with their scumware. Since it's illegal of make viruses... They'd be in a damn if they do.. damned if they don't situation.. I hope. We could always make a "proxy" nation to take the heat instead of shireroth....hehehe Blaim that nation. There plan. yes? Erik Mortis BrookshireCommoner of Alexandretta

[Scott Alexander]

Well, no. It all depends on whether this is traceable through proxies. It shouldn't be, but I want Ari's confirmation on that before we go ahead.

[Kaiser Wyltheow I]

If it weren't such a pain for me to do admin stuff with this account...i would let him in...but yeah... Wylþeow du GrifosThe Kaiser of ShirerothThe gods blessed you with power and a visionThe gods gave you life to accomplish a mission...

[Phoenix the Risen]

One of the reasons I love having Admin.I removed Mattlore from the list as well; I didn't see any particular reason why he would be on the list, nor was he specifically authorized. Phoenix the Risen - Dutchess of Kildare - Political Nuisance but at least She gets the job done. - Official Genkher of Gryphon Avocatio's Cool Short Sig and Gryphon the Pure's Awesome Tables! - COME BACK, STEVE!!! -"To quote a former Kaiser.... 'Shireroth doesn't give up land....'" ~UEC (Quoting Kaiser Letifer I), In response to claims on the Raynor Isles"To paraphrase a former Kaiser: 'Here! Take Amity for free! And that other half of Mar Sara too!'" ~SaiKar LumEth, (Paraphrasing Kaiser Mog I) In response to UEC"To paraphrase a former angry mob "DOWN WITH THE EVIL LAND-GIVING AWAY KAISER! REVOLT! REBELLION! CIVIL WAR!" ~Scott Siskind, (paraphrasing the Letifer Rebellion group) In response to SaiKar LumEth"I HEARBY QUESTION THE KAISERESS AUTHORITY!" ~Gryphon Avocado (Switching Day)

[Ari Rahikkala]

Assuming that your IPs won't get blacklisted on the servers you're going to DoS, assuming the pages you're requesting won't be cached somewhere between you and your actual target, assuming you don't mind doing something that'll very likely be a violation of your ISP's AUP (and thus probably get your connection cut off), assuming whoever you're attacking has very little bandwidth, assuming not one of the proxies is smart enough to record your IP addresses and access times (because even providers of anonymous proxies don't want to enable people to DoS servers), assuming the proxies you'll be using will be stupid enough not to rate-limit connections, assuming you'll actually do the DoS in a way that might even work (SYN floods are the traditional way - simple and cheap but defeatable by any sysadmin worth zir salt, distributed reflection looks interesting but I wouldn't trust it yet since "Steve Gibson's technical competence" is an oxymoron), assuming those you'll be attacking won't get angry and crack your boxen with some 0day Windows XP remote vulnerability... well, it still probably wouldn't work due to some reason I've forgotten. Getting servers off the internet is quite possible, and you can do it without much technical competence, however. All you need is to be a girl and care enough to show some interest in a script kiddie - he'll DoS anyone for you.* ari dons his grumpy GNU/Linux guru garbs *Here's a CD-R, kid. Go burn yourself a real OS. Do you really believe Project Bluebook revealed EVERYTHING the Army Air Corps knew? Do you know what REALLY happened at Roswell, New Mexico in the late 1940s? Have you even heard about the Men in Black? Do you have any friends who have `missing days'? Do you sleep with your window unlocked?Be seeing you...Edité(e)(s) par: Ari Rahikkala à: 3/16/04 2:11 am

[Scott Alexander]

Bah...well...glad you told us. I suppose I'll just have to keep writing letters to the Federal Trade Commission...although that hardly seems like a macho way to express blinding rage.

[Erik Mortis]

I use 98 or RHL 9... Erik Mortis BrookshireCommoner of Alexandretta

[Ari Rahikkala]

Requesting declassification per Declassification act of 3742.