Vote: Duchy of Hyperborea

[Kaiser Mors III]

As there has been so much debate over it and as it would be easier to do it with a vote.Therefore, The Barony of Hyperborea shall be made a Duchy.Therefore, The Duchy of Elywnn shall be made a Barony, within the Duchy of Hyperborea.Therefore, all Ruling nobles in mentioned lands shall retain their positions, save for the proper changes in title to match the changes in status. Mortis BrookshireKaiser of Shireroth

[Mattlore Devious]

LOTH Nay 6

[Gryphon Avocatio]

Yardistan AYE 4 -Gryphon Avocatio- Lord Governor and Duke of all Yardistan - Minister of Research and Education, Shireroth - Shirerothian Elder - SAVE THE KIWI!! - Lover of Llamas Give me your child, and by the age of five, I can make him a priest or a thief or a scholar.

[Kaiser Mors III]

Brookshire, Aye. (4) Mortis BrookshireKaiser of Shireroth

[Gryphon Avocatio]

this is going to be a close one....i can tell already... -Gryphon Avocatio- Lord Governor and Duke of all Yardistan - Minister of Research and Education, Shireroth - Shirerothian Elder - SAVE THE KIWI!! - Lover of Llamas Give me your child, and by the age of five, I can make him a priest or a thief or a scholar.

[Eriana Moon]

Matt.... I'd like to here why you voted Nay... Baroness of Lunaris in The Republic of ShirerothBaroness-Councilor of Tallandor-New Barbary in Treesia

[Scott Alexander]

I think it's only appropriate that Hyperborea ABSTAIN (2) because of that conflict-of-interest thingy.

[Phoenix the Risen]

Kildare Abstains, courteously (6) Phoenix the Risen - Dutchess of Kildare - Political Nuisance but at least She gets the job done. - Official Genkher of Gryphon Avocatio's Cool Short Sig and Gryphon the Pure's Awesome Tables! - COME BACK, STEVE!!! -"To quote a former Kaiser.... 'Shireroth doesn't give up land....'" ~UEC (Quoting Kaiser Letifer I), In response to claims on the Raynor Isles"To paraphrase a former Kaiser: 'Here! Take Amity for free! And that other half of Mar Sara too!'" ~SaiKar LumEth, (Paraphrasing Kaiser Mog I) In response to UEC"To paraphrase a former angry mob "DOWN WITH THE EVIL LAND-GIVING AWAY KAISER! REVOLT! REBELLION! CIVIL WAR!" ~Scott Siskind, (paraphrasing the Letifer Rebellion group) In response to SaiKar LumEth"I HEARBY QUESTION THE KAISERESS AUTHORITY!" ~Gryphon Avocado (Switching Day)

[Rakesh86]

Alexandretta AYE (2)

[Phoenix the Risen]

Okay, I've been rethinking this a bit. Ever since I joined Shireroth, Elwynn has been a Duchy. I couldn't imagine seeing it as a Barony, neither on the board, nor on the map. I want to see Hyperborea as a Duchy. It has proved its worth in activity, both cultural and political. However I could not see that happening by simply demoting Elwynn to Barony status.Kildare changes to NAY (6) Phoenix the Risen - Dutchess of Kildare - Political Nuisance but at least She gets the job done. - Official Genkher of Gryphon Avocatio's Cool Short Sig and Gryphon the Pure's Awesome Tables! - COME BACK, STEVE!!! -"To quote a former Kaiser.... 'Shireroth doesn't give up land....'" ~UEC (Quoting Kaiser Letifer I), In response to claims on the Raynor Isles"To paraphrase a former Kaiser: 'Here! Take Amity for free! And that other half of Mar Sara too!'" ~SaiKar LumEth, (Paraphrasing Kaiser Mog I) In response to UEC"To paraphrase a former angry mob "DOWN WITH THE EVIL LAND-GIVING AWAY KAISER! REVOLT! REBELLION! CIVIL WAR!" ~Scott Siskind, (paraphrasing the Letifer Rebellion group) In response to SaiKar LumEth"I HEARBY QUESTION THE KAISERESS AUTHORITY!" ~Gryphon Avocado (Switching Day)

[Eriana Moon]

Lunaris (2) Abstains untill further notis. Baroness of Lunaris in The Republic of ShirerothBaroness-Councilor of Tallandor-New Barbary in Treesia

[Gman Russell]

BAM votes nay. (2) (sorry Scott, this violates the FHA)Maybe Scott should run for Duke of Elwynn...

[Gryphon Avocatio]

would it?Hyperborea's population, if this were to go through, would also include Elwynn's...if Elwynn with Hyperborea's population is good, than everything is fine...if not.,..well...we're not really changing anything, are we? -Gryphon Avocatio- Lord Governor and Duke of all Yardistan - Minister of Research and Education, Shireroth - Shirerothian Elder - SAVE THE KIWI!! - Lover of Llamas Give me your child, and by the age of five, I can make him a priest or a thief or a scholar.

[Scott Alexander]

How does this violate FHA?Right now there are 2 or maybe 3 Elwynners and 3 Hyperboreans for a total of 5 or 6 in Duchy of Elwynn. If this passed there would be 2 or maybe 3 Elwynners (less if Mari leaves) and 3 Hyperboreans for a total of 5 or 6 in the Duchy of Hyperborea. It would only violate FHA if we tried to make them both Duchies, which I don't think we are.

[Jadie of Goldshire]

Goldshire AYE (4)Yee-haw! Jadie of GoldshireCarry on with your lives people...nothing to see here.

[Gman Russell]

Wait... so your saying this act basicly switches the two area's positions?

[Gryphon Avocatio]

yep...joseph's...does violate the fha3 I think -Gryphon Avocatio- Lord Governor and Duke of all Yardistan - Minister of Research and Education, Shireroth - Shirerothian Elder - SAVE THE KIWI!! - Lover of Llamas Give me your child, and by the age of five, I can make him a priest or a thief or a scholar.

[Scott Alexander]

Although...it would seem if we did want to violate the FHA for any reason, we legally could, since it was us who wrote it in the first place and we can certainly revoke it or temporarily suspend it...so it's just to be taken as a guideline...but it's a good guideline and we proly shouldn't be messing with it.

[Gryphon Avocatio]

We shouldn't mess with it.Furthermore, if we are just going to circumvent the laws we pass, than why even bother passing them to begin with? -Gryphon Avocatio- Lord Governor and Duke of all Yardistan - Minister of Research and Education, Shireroth - Shirerothian Elder - SAVE THE KIWI!! - Lover of Llamas Give me your child, and by the age of five, I can make him a priest or a thief or a scholar.

[Eriana Moon]

Quote:we can certainly revoke it or temporarily suspend it...so it's just to be taken as a guidelineSory Scott but this makes me very nervus... In my mind Laws are las and should be folowed. They are not guidelines to be pushed aside for our convinience. If we passed it in the first place it was for a reson. We should ither folow it or rewright it threw the landsraad. It there for reson but if there's a problen with it lets fix it but going around it for our conveniance is not good. It belittles our laws..... Baroness of Lunaris in The Republic of ShirerothBaroness-Councilor of Tallandor-New Barbary in Treesia

[Kaiser Mors III]

Imperial Statement:Joseph's Ultimatum has been found to be in Violation of the Lawbook (FHA part). The Landsraad is subject to the laws it passes prior. If the Landsraad does not wish to follow a law when writing another law or taking an action, It must first revoke and/or edit the law in question.I put this to the Landsraad and didn't just decree it so that Mari couldn't just say "The mean man is putting me down" again. (since she kept going on about how I'm being mean to HER and stuff. Trying to get her to leave, Not that I've seen her vote here. Which kinda says something. And since it was easier to do it this way than decreeing it, sicne that required the use of loopholes and funny law dancing around of...(though it IS perfectly legal). Mortis BrookshireKaiser of ShirerothEdited by: Kaiser Mors III at: 12/23/03 5:34 pm

[Phoenix the Risen]

Considering that this vote was proposed at (12/19/03 3:38 pm), by law it should be closed as of two and a half hours ago.As it stands, the votes are as follows:Duchy of Brookshire: +4- Barony of Alexandretta: +2Duchy of Goldshire: +4- Barony of Lunaris: (2)Duchy of Kildare: -6Duchy of Elwynn: ((4))- Barony of Hyperborea: (2)Duchy of Yardistan: +4- Barony of Amity and Mirioth: -2Duchy of Lothlaria: -6So as is, the vote is tied. I suspect that the Prætor will extend the vote for the extra two days. Assuming no votes are reversed in this time, if Duchess Mari ever shows up to defend herself, the vote will fail. Otherwise, it is dependent upon the opinions of Lunaris and Hyperborea.One thing I can see to note is the fact that Mari Greenwood, Duchess of Hyperborea, is the only noble who has not cast her votes yet. Phoenix the Risen - Dutchess of Kildare - Political Nuisance but at least She gets the job done. - Official Genkher of Gryphon Avocatio's Cool Short Sig and Gryphon the Pure's Awesome Tables! - COME BACK, STEVE!!! -"To quote a former Kaiser.... 'Shireroth doesn't give up land....'" ~UEC (Quoting Kaiser Letifer I), In response to claims on the Raynor Isles"To paraphrase a former Kaiser: 'Here! Take Amity for free! And that other half of Mar Sara too!'" ~SaiKar LumEth, (Paraphrasing Kaiser Mog I) In response to UEC"To paraphrase a former angry mob "DOWN WITH THE EVIL LAND-GIVING AWAY KAISER! REVOLT! REBELLION! CIVIL WAR!" ~Scott Siskind, (paraphrasing the Letifer Rebellion group) In response to SaiKar LumEth"I HEARBY QUESTION THE KAISERESS AUTHORITY!" ~Gryphon Avocado (Switching Day)

[Eriana Moon]

Lunaris (2) Aye Baroness of Lunaris in The Republic of ShirerothBaroness-Councilor of Tallandor-New Barbary in Treesia

[Gryphon Avocatio]

Mari really ought to have voted...but it would seem she doesn't care enough anymore... -Gryphon Avocatio- Lord Governor and Duke of all Yardistan - Minister of Research and Education, Shireroth - Shirerothian Elder - SAVE THE KIWI!! - Lover of Llamas Give me your child, and by the age of five, I can make him a priest or a thief or a scholar.

[Kaiser Mors III]

That kinda says something... Mortis BrookshireKaiser of Shireroth

[Phoenix the Risen]

From the Lawbook:Quote:IV. The LandsraadB. Procedure2. Votinga. A bill will be on the voting floor for the space of four days, or until a majority is obtained. At any time before the week is up, the Prætor may choose to extend the voting period an additional three days if and only if he or she believes that nobles with an active interest in it have not gotten a chance to vote, and that these nobles could significantly impact the In all other cases, the Prætor should declare the vote passed or failed, close, and archive it after the four days are up. If the Prætor fails to do so, the vote is nevertheless considered unofficially passed.First point:With six Duchies, at Six (6) votes per Duchy, we have a grand total of thirty-six (36) votes. To aquire a majority, the vote would require nineteen (19) votes in one direction. The only way that this can be acheived right now is for a vote to be reversed, or for Elwynn to cast in favour of the act. Otherwise, a majority cannot be attained.Second point:I strongly urge the Prætor to extend the voting period until Mari Greenwood, Duchess of Elwynn, can cast her vote. Considering the fact that this act would affect her the most of any of us, and that she has already argued against this motion before it went to the Landsraad, I believe we can safely say that she has an active interest.Third point:Umm... the last sentence of that clause implies that if the Prætor does not show up by the "end of the week", that the vote is automatically passed... I do not think it was meant that way... it should be changed... Phoenix the Risen - Dutchess of Kildare - Political Nuisance but at least She gets the job done. - Official Genkher of Gryphon Avocatio's Cool Short Sig and Gryphon the Pure's Awesome Tables! - COME BACK, STEVE!!! -"To quote a former Kaiser.... 'Shireroth doesn't give up land....'" ~UEC (Quoting Kaiser Letifer I), In response to claims on the Raynor Isles"To paraphrase a former Kaiser: 'Here! Take Amity for free! And that other half of Mar Sara too!'" ~SaiKar LumEth, (Paraphrasing Kaiser Mog I) In response to UEC"To paraphrase a former angry mob "DOWN WITH THE EVIL LAND-GIVING AWAY KAISER! REVOLT! REBELLION! CIVIL WAR!" ~Scott Siskind, (paraphrasing the Letifer Rebellion group) In response to SaiKar LumEth"I HEARBY QUESTION THE KAISERESS AUTHORITY!" ~Gryphon Avocado (Switching Day)

[Kaiser Mors III]

If Mari doens't show up it's her own damn fault, and we shouldn't break the rules for her... Mortis BrookshireKaiser of Shireroth

[Phoenix the Risen]

what do you mean "break the rules"?! I'm suggesting something explicitly mentioned in the rules! Phoenix the Risen - Dutchess of Kildare - Political Nuisance but at least She gets the job done. - Official Genkher of Gryphon Avocatio's Cool Short Sig and Gryphon the Pure's Awesome Tables! - COME BACK, STEVE!!! -"To quote a former Kaiser.... 'Shireroth doesn't give up land....'" ~UEC (Quoting Kaiser Letifer I), In response to claims on the Raynor Isles"To paraphrase a former Kaiser: 'Here! Take Amity for free! And that other half of Mar Sara too!'" ~SaiKar LumEth, (Paraphrasing Kaiser Mog I) In response to UEC"To paraphrase a former angry mob "DOWN WITH THE EVIL LAND-GIVING AWAY KAISER! REVOLT! REBELLION! CIVIL WAR!" ~Scott Siskind, (paraphrasing the Letifer Rebellion group) In response to SaiKar LumEth"I HEARBY QUESTION THE KAISERESS AUTHORITY!" ~Gryphon Avocado (Switching Day)

[Kaiser Mors III]

You're saying to extend it TILL mari votes.. she may not vote for a week.. which is beyond 3 days... Mortis BrookshireKaiser of Shireroth

[Phoenix the Risen]

well, it doesn't actually say in the lawbook that three days is the limit... but what I meant was to give her more chance to be heard... 3 days -should- be fine *crosses fingers* Phoenix the Risen - Dutchess of Kildare - Political Nuisance but at least She gets the job done. - Official Genkher of Gryphon Avocatio's Cool Short Sig and Gryphon the Pure's Awesome Tables! - COME BACK, STEVE!!! -"To quote a former Kaiser.... 'Shireroth doesn't give up land....'" ~UEC (Quoting Kaiser Letifer I), In response to claims on the Raynor Isles"To paraphrase a former Kaiser: 'Here! Take Amity for free! And that other half of Mar Sara too!'" ~SaiKar LumEth, (Paraphrasing Kaiser Mog I) In response to UEC"To paraphrase a former angry mob "DOWN WITH THE EVIL LAND-GIVING AWAY KAISER! REVOLT! REBELLION! CIVIL WAR!" ~Scott Siskind, (paraphrasing the Letifer Rebellion group) In response to SaiKar LumEth"I HEARBY QUESTION THE KAISERESS AUTHORITY!" ~Gryphon Avocado (Switching Day)