Shireroth

Quoth KingJeremy at http://micras.org/forum/viewtopic.php?p=28439#28439

Harald, the recent vote of confidence has shown 100% public support for King Wentworth, he is the people's King where as hesan can't constitutionally even be King and therefore I have more claim to the throne of England than Hesam has to the throne of Bosworth.

Meanwhile, Scott, Bosworth have been saying "Screw this, we're out" for weeks but people still keep posting and here you are still posting what is basically an act of nationally condoned vandalism and theft from a neutral research station. I don't know if King Joe himself is personally on the ships as we generally don't search neutral vessels without cause to do so. If we recieve sound evidence that he is commanding military attacks from Willow then he will be promptly repatriated by the BRAF.

Not so long ago, we considered the idea of narrative causality - of having Erik replaced as Kaiser as his recwar forces were overwhelmed in the War of the Sightseers.

We rejected it.

Erik was doing excellently, you see, running one of the best Kaiserships we've ever had. The recwar had been fun almost from the beginning (we all had some problems understanding what Hypatia's Mom was doing when she seemed to overreact hugely to Erik's initial "attack", but after that it was all consensual and a great time for all involved). By maintaining the separation between fantasy and government, we could both have some recwar fun and keep the nation running excellently.

Now, this separation has always been a little bit fuzzy, yes. We've had our assassinations and annexations-by-war and various other things that have straddled the line, but we've done them *only when we've had consensus*. Whenever there's been genuine disagreement in Shireroth, we have chosen to solve it not by overrunning the other guy with fantasy troops, but sitting down and working the issue itself out together.

*We can't depend on the rest of the world understanding this*. Shireroth has been around for ages, but Jeremy never was a citizen. He hasn't been taught this way of thinking. We know perfectly well, being Shirithians, it's nonsense to say we're subjugating someone else with military forces. Do the people who are considering themselves subjugated at the moment understand it, too?

Just consider what Jeremy said. He went from "gtfo, I polled our citizens and none of us want you here at all" to "besides, you're looting our imaginary research base" in one breath. Does that sound like he's maintaining a separation between fantasy and government the way we know it should be maintained?

While I'm at it, consider the recent Imperial Decree #285. Consider the *entirety* of the King Hasan I of Bosworthl thread. Are *we* helping the Bosworthians take it easy and not take the recwar too seriously?

Every moment we spend pretending we're bullying Bosworth, Bosworth is actually considering itself bullied... and getting more and more of the world to agree with them that they're being bullied.

As always, everyone involved has done a great job on the battleground itself (rkprcg gung V qba'g npghnyyl ernq erpjne guernqf irel pnershyyl, ohg url, V qvq ernq gur fhzznevrf naq fxvz fbzr bs gur pbagrag, naq vg qvq ybbx vagrerfgvat), and I know I'm in no position to make demands after having contributed not a single post myself... but with respect, I suggest that either:

- we do what Ardashir said. Take the interesting plotlines to Shireroth, screw the rest.
- we explain to the Bosworthians in detail that no, the whole declaring-Hasan-king-of-Bosworth and all the related stuff was actually a figment of our imaginations and if we ever made it seem any other way, that's just because we expected you guys to play along because we're used to everyone doing exactly that in Shireroth. Also, we open a thread where we throw away the imaginary baggage and explain what I've been trying to explain in this post so far.

I beg of you to listen to Ari.

Shireroth's intentions - if they are as Ari has depicted - have clearly been taken the wrong way over at the MCS.

Here's how it looked:

Shirerithian A: Anyone else bored?
B: Yeah, we have all this land and that, but we never do anything outside it.
A: I agree. CHARGE!

It basically looks like Shireroth have just decided to get involved a bit, by throwing their weight around, and ending up looking like idiots who are fairly out of touch. I am sure that this isn't the case.

Here's what I suggest. You don't have to take any of my advice, but it may help you, both in getting Jeremy off your back, and getting you out of the PR grave you appear to have dug.

1. As has previously been highlighted somewhere, the council members are less than sympathetic towards you, so don't do as Erik suggests and 'Fuck the MCS,' as they do have 'authority on the matter' as they can have you thrown off (hence the reference to council views above). Just because you were there at the start/are large/various other reasons, doesn't make you immune

2. Remove the Kaiser/Ardashir, whoever it is at the moment, from the throne of Bosworth. It's causing more arguments than it's worth. Let Bosworth go back to Bosworth. By all means occupy it, it's a war, but I suggest not staking a claim to the throne/Bosworth/everything in it/polar ice caps etc.

3. Where have Antica come from?

4. Keep back from Jeremy/Brittania for the time being. Jeremy wants the Council to do something about you as it is, and if he kicks up a scene at the MCS, he will have support. The Council will have no alterntive but to deal with Shireroth in some way.

5. Move out of Darwin. a) Why did you go there in the first place? b) It's only fuelling Jeremy's fire.

6. Sixth and lastly, think before you speak. Some are viewing Shirithians/Shireroth in general as very arrogant and rather ignorant. Again, I'm sure that's not the case, but it is fast becoming the perception.


I hope I don't sound like I'm preaching, I only want to stop you before it's too late. I've no doubt there'll be a furious backlash, so I'll be off, i can be PM'd on the MCS if you so wish. I don't have any Bosworth connections at all either, so I'm not trying to save them.

We could always grant the crown to this Wentworth chap. The rebels will say that we had no authority to do so and that he's been the king the whole time. We'll point to the treaty and say that the facts indicate otherwise. In any event we'll have reached the point where we can mutually disengage whilst muttering insults at each other under our breath. Status quo ante bellum anyone? We can bring the interesting plotlines left over from the war back here and start developing them as we might see fit. In view of that I don't support any notion of a 'Dallas'-style trope where we all wake up and it was just a nasty dream afflicting our collective unconciousness (although if we were to take that route I'm sure the Gralans could have some fun battling daemons in the dreamscape... or something). The events of the narrative of the War of Jeremy's Nose can be considered canonical to Shirerithian history - we invaded and occupied the territory of a hostile neighbour and imposed a harsh peace settlement, and it was all good fun and we a great time imposing ourselves as rulers on a hostile populace, but then there was an insurgency and the neighbours got upset - so far so Iraq - and we withdrew leaving behind a token administration that was promptly overwhelmed and consigned to the dustbin of history. Jeremy understands the division between the simulation and the 'real' political dimension of the conflict - it just so happened that his side signed a treaty that compromised Bosworth on both points and therefore he is forced to be muddled in his justifications for his obstinate refusal to surrender.

As I say - that was fun, we really must do it again sometime* but next time we really must secure a contract before we get too far down the line.

The pressing reason for ending this war shortly is not for the sake of the Bosworth or the Britannic Empire but because there is a danger of a recwar escalating into a meta-conflict between the MCS and one of its most powerful and long established members. And the last time one of those meta-conflicts was had it resulted in a schism and the creation of Giess. Do we really want a repeat of that performance?

*Probably "off-world" or internally considering how skitish the MCS has become of late.

So my attempts to stop the war over the past three weeks by:
a. Shireroth's method (ie getting Jeremy to stop being arrogant and actually admit his own surrender document for once)
b. A mutually equitable method (confer the land division of the island, various proposals sent to Joe, the judge forcing surrender) etc.
have been entirely unnoticed, Babs?

Malarbor demands more attention!

But yes, I've been trying to stop this war for some time so I'll accept whatever works ... (I must admit though, declaring Hasan King I always thought too far and made a. rather hard)

Do I look like I'm bothered about what Malarbor demands?

You can't do it on your own, those at... boardroom level... *raises eyes heavenwards* need to join in.

I said "Fuck the MCS"? I kinda think that's opposite of what I've been doing over here.

Ah yes, that. I wasn't aware they were related topics. I was saying Fuck the MCS in regards to it impinging on the rights of nations.

Erik is the Good Guy. I was the one saying we could "Forget the MCS", but I'm almost over it.

And if I may add my two cents worth, overblown hystrionics (see top post) seem to be a long-cherished Shirerithian tradition. If the parameters of a recwar are delineated ahead of time, the emotions can seem to run as high as necessary to the story line. I think, though, that a few i's may have gone undotted, and a few t's uncrossed in the framing of this war. Now that we have all agreed to stop, I think we just need to shake hands and return to our respective corners, emerging, when emotions cool, as friends in micronationry. This is all pretend, guys!!! It was for fun!!! and to break up the boredom. It's not the end of the world. And Shireroth is not really the 5000 pound gorilla threatening the entirety of Micras. We really do respect the territory of other states, but recwars can be a fun way to interact here, if all parties understand the groundrules.

We really do respect the territory of other states, but recwars can be a fun way to interact here, if all parties understand the groundrules.

And if some don't act like little childs...

*Looks to the English faction*

3. Where have Antica come from?

Really, we were just bored. We asked permission before barging in, through. Sadly, we seem to have jumped on the bandwagon a bit late, but I hope we can get in on the last bits of action before the whole thing winds up.

Jonas wrote:

We really do respect the territory of other states, but recwars can be a fun way to interact here, if all parties understand the groundrules.

And if some don't act like little childs...

*Looks to the English faction*

Have you ever considered the fact you declared war on them, thus starting it all

They fired first.

babs wrote:

Jonas wrote:

We really do respect the territory of other states, but recwars can be a fun way to interact here, if all parties understand the groundrules.

And if some don't act like little childs...

*Looks to the English faction*

Have you ever considered the fact you declared war on them, thus starting it all

Let's have that perfectly clear, because it keeps coming up. We declared a chartered conflict on the Brittanic Empire. Bosworth randomly interfered and fired on us.

Don't even start on that. Bosworth sailed down - through international waters - to an island - which was not owned by anyone - to try and stop you lot and NB from ripping each other limbs from limb, they did not interfere.

Coming from the guy that was so certain Jeremy was NOT Dominique. I mean, what a preposterous idea? If he was Dominique, surely Babs would have deduced that before the rest of us?

Bosworth, (the papelstate of NB), was not sailing in as peacekeepers. They were sailing in to claim the island because NB was not on the map yet. And while we're at it, how exactly are you involved in this situation babs? Are you speaking as an official? As a represented party of interest or involvement? Basically, why are you involving yourself in this?

I am the voice of the silent majority.

You'd think they could have picked a voice less tiring to listen to.

The good thing about silent majorities is that one can speak on their behalf without fear of contradiction.

babs wrote:Don't even start on that. Bosworth sailed down - through Shirithian waters - to an island - which was claimed by two separate nations and a warzone- to try to stop Shireroth from ripping NB limbs from limb, and they continued to interfere.

Babs, as much as you're a friend, do see sense ...

Replace 'Babs' in that sentence with Andreas and you've got exactly what I'm thinking.

Could you people just be adults for a moment and STOP ARGUING ABOUT WHO STARTED THE FIGHT? Just because Jonas happened to mention acting like little children doesn't mean that you should regress back to kindergarten...

Sounds fair. What matters is the stopping of the fight.

Micronational pacifism is a joke.

Are we witnessing the first micronational instance of an overt 'exit strategy' for a theatre of war?

Who says we're fantasists detatched from the modern world....

Lets just launch a war at finding Jeremy and killing him...

like finding Osama Bin Laden

Yes, because that's going well.

Of Course it is! Havent you ever heard george w. bush?

I am the voice of the silent majority.

The Nixonian theme continues.