Shireroth

I really like Plan G for the Paring Proposition, but there are a few changes I wanted to suggest. Apologies for the image quality: not all of us have the webspace to host giant pngs.



This is the same as Bill's Plan G except for a few modifications. Antica now keeps all its territory, answering one Landsraad complaint. We also keep the entire isle of Jaris as well as the Lesser Automatica area. In exchange, we give up the Cognito area (in the original Plan G, for some reason Lothlaria was crammed into here, but that was just silly) and the island chains of the Raynor Islands and Norfolk.

This is compliant with the Treaty of Aquilaria in that it preserves Antican lands. It also keeps more of our territories intact instead of splitting them up into a few tiny enclaves and avoids large-scale reorganization of stuff like moving Lothlaria halfway across the globe. Although Norfolk and the Raynor Islands are both very old, neither had very much cultural development, and if things are anything like they were when I was MCS cartographer, those little island chains are what new countries just LOVE.

I like it.

As do I!

Thank you, Scott. This new plan resolves my greatest concern, and also keeps the territory of our new Barony of Lumina's Light intact. This has my grateful support.

I don't think that is going to work. First of all, I think I see more land added to Antica.

Second of all, when it comes to the MCS, Ryan himself said that the Treaty of Aquilaria is worthless. He said that he wanted to reduce Antica to a territory the size of Norfolk. Reducing Antica slightly will at least help the valid point that Antica is too inflated for its territory - we have only one active citizen in that huge hunk of land, after all.

Lesser Automatica is a must when it comes to removal as Ryan had told me - it is completely worthless.

Third of all, I don't want us to lose Norfolk. Raynor Islands I have less of an attachment to, but Norfolk was a friggin' Apollonian micronation and I don't want to lose that, regardless if it is developed or not.

Finally, it should be noted that we are going to be used as a basis for how much land other nations deserve - e.g. the ideal population density for the MCs map. Going to be kind of hard to justify expanding the other nations if we don't lose enough land.

End result: Unacceptable. Bjorngrad being an enclave was the compromise for allowing Mar Sara to be an enclave, by the way. If you really want though, I'll add Lac Glacei to the Ghastly Yellow.

It's possible that Delphi and Rakesh will be more active later on, if he's found innocent (however, I understand that that's merely a future possibilty, and we must deal with the MCS here and now). However, MeanBean only posts when he has something funny to say (no offense) and I haven't seen CharlDelta on here in God knows when. At the moment, it's sort of my duty to defend the Duchy of Antica, because no one else is here to do it. So if you're going to cut down Antican lands, and since there's not much I can do to stop you save to speak here, may I ask that you simply cut off the large lumps of land in the north of Skiron and the extreme west of Platea, as per Poroposition....E, was it? And simply add that to Plan g2.
EDIT: Also, if you want, you might want to move the border of Kaikias back north again. That was probably a typo anyway.

Antica hasn't had more land added to it; I just filled back in the parts you had yellowed, so unless you yellowed more than existed before, it's the same.

If Ryan wants to get rid of LA, that's fine, and then we can keep Norfolk in exchange or something.

Antica's tricky, because I don't know what's going to happen after Delphi's trial. If he's found guilty and the Kaiser goes for a big punishment, he may well decide to secede. Until that happens one way or the other, though, I think we should keep it intact. I really like the shape of it also; it's one of the more well-done countries on there. Removing the knob from Skiron would make it sooo boring.

how on earth can you say antica looks good? it is the horriblest, horriblest, horriblest, horriblest, horriblest, horriblest, horriblest, horriblest shape land ever.

Antica looks like it has a boner. :P

The MCS reserves the right to modify beyond any signed treaties at our discretion as per our Terms of Service, which were legally reviewed and approved by the late Robert Davis and not-so-late Liam Sinclair, both lawyers.

Antica as it presently stands doesn't warrant that much land. There's two people hogging all that space. Now active or not, they're not going to keep all that land.

Otherwise, I don't have much of a problem with the other reductions. Bjorngard will be making some modifications into a thinner coastal strip and a small colony on Drakenoya. As for Lesser Automatica, ditching it would help improve the "remoteness" feel of Bjorngard I like to emphasise. So that would be a good thing.

if things are anything like they were when I was MCS cartographer, those little island chains are what new countries just LOVE.

Ohhhh yes... *Still remembers his claim for Shirlan* They make for such delightfully intricate national maps. Let's face it, islands are cartographically sexy.

At any rate... this too is a good plan. It feels a little crummy to give up Norfolk, although as long as we keep Tymaria City itself, it's not the most horrible option.

Ya, it's a REALLY good plan, but as I wrote in the Pendulum, I'm not sure if we'll be able to sell it to the Landsraad. Someone should put this up there and force it down their noble throats.

Baldwin PlantagenetJulii wrote:Ya, it's a REALLY good plan, but as I wrote in the Pendulum, I'm not sure if we'll be able to sell it to the Landsraad. Someone should put this up there and force it down their noble throats.

Legislative suppository?

I should have written "shove it up their noble anuses" instead. :P

Okay, how about we change this to:

1. Give up Lesser Automatica
2. Not give up Norfolk

Although I realize Antica's got a lot of land right now, right now it's part of Shireroth and we should be able to simply average it out with the rest of Shireroth. So it'd be perfectly acceptable to just give up Cognito in exchange for keeping an equalish amount of land in Antica. If they become independent, then you can judge them separately.

Also, we shouldn't give up Araxion, that little slice of Elwynn near Lesser Automatica, because the Count of Araxion just showed up and filled out the Census.

If they become independent, then you can judge them separately.

If they become independent, odds are that they would lose their entire land altogether.

Why don't we scale Norfolk down to just Tymaria City and another port enclave simply titled.... *drumroll* Norfolk.

Norfolk was always supposed to be a port republic anyways. Remember the battleship for the forum background? It doesn't need all that land when it can be a small port, kinda like how the Spanish own Ceuta(sp?) in Morocco.

And the Anticans [independent ones] want to move their whole land anyways to shift it around into what Shireroth abandons. I kinda get the feeling they want Shireroth to abandon its Antica so they can reclaim it (not a bad idea, IMO).

As an afterthought, just sink Tymaria City. Noone wants to remember it anyways. :P

Quote:
If they become independent, then you can judge them separately.


If they become independent, odds are that they would lose their entire land altogether.

If they become independent, I shan't be going with them...