Shireroth

I understand where you are coming from with this suggestion, but it would be too much hassle to keep track of. It's hard as it is.

Too much hassle to keep track of...as opposed to the current system where people who control counties are not counts, and counts do not necessarily control counties? If the problem is it's confusing and opaque, the pot's kind of calling kettle black.

Eh okay. Regardless, I don't support such a change. I would like for the current new system to get more than a couple of days before it is changed again.

I'd rather not make the entire nation noble... Land-controllers, maybe, but not all nobles. Thus we rename counties. Anyways, the land should be named for the noble, not the noble for the land.

I agree there.

Kaiseress Anandja II wrote:Count should be for sub-houses, that is, houses within major houses. I understand where you are coming from with this suggestion, but it would be too much hassle to keep track of. It's hard as it is.

Radical idea – what if the title “Count” was the non-inheritable one, and applied to all decent Shirithians; and whichever one we currently have as non-inheritable was the inheritable one and applied to minor houses in the conditions outlined above. Then we keep tradition and the house/noble system maintains its integrity.

What is the point with a title if everyone has it?

Not everyone – those who are decent. That way we distinguish between new/inactive citizens and those who have become valued members of the community.

Isn't that distinction made anyway?

How so?

By mutual respect?

Well, yeah, you could do that, but surely the point of the new house system is to make all that plain and quantifiable

..........the point of the new house system..........

Is to keep ultimate control in as small a number of hands as possible.

Oh come off it. So you mean by letting the Houses form and dissolve all by themselves, and having a written down system for how to claim, we concentrate power? If anything, power was very concentrated in a few hands under the duchy system.

Kaiseress Anandja II wrote:Oh come off it. So you mean by letting the Houses form and dissolve all by themselves, and having a written down system for how to claim, we concentrate power? If anything, power was very concentrated in a few hands under the duchy system.

With all respect, I disagree about that one: in the first place you had the Dukes who represented their people (and they had to listen if they didn't want to lose control). The current system is more one of a few people that are appointed for the job. But because they don't necessary represent a Duchy, it will be more their own opinion and vote that will be spoken in the Landsraad. I remember, for example, that the Seanad of Kildare quite often gave me advise of how to vote.
I'm not complaining, but just disagree with what you are saying here, Your Niftiness.

They do represent a House where people can leave and take their counties with them. The Duchy system was very rigid, which allowed Dukes much more leeway than the House system does.

Duchies never represented the people in them. We sometimes liked to say they did, but they never did. I could never leave Brookshire and take Monty Crisco with me. I could leave Mortis and take Monty Crisco with me.

People (jake..et al.) keep making these wild claims about the old vs new system and they are getting kinda ridiculous. The House system wasn't some power grab by the throne it wasn't to concentrate power. It was to break the rigidity of the system, to allow for new and diverse options.

The very fact that we can have arguments about the system to this degree kinda proves it. There wasn't much room to maneuver under the old system.

And Jonas, your argument also fails in that you got advice from the Saenad under the old system, and you can get it from the same body under the new. Kalire and Kildare have the same exact structure that they did before the Change. EXACTLY the same.

Erik Mortis wrote: And Jonas, your argument also fails in that you got advice from the Saenad under the old system, and you can get it from the same body under the new. Kalire and Kildare have the same exact structure that they did before the Change. EXACTLY the same.

No, the Dutch doesn't have the power to vote. A big difference, like I explained.

Do something about it then.

You lost the power to vote cause you as a House ASKED me to demote you. I probably still have the PM. Do I need to show you?

Erik Mortis wrote:You lost the power to vote cause you as a House ASKED me to demote you. I probably still have the PM. Do I need to show you?

No, Jonas and I are quite aware of it; which is obviously why I raised the question "Do we want to be a Major House" in the thread in Kildare about it.

Hoho! Wait a minute, I didn't say that I want it to be like that. I was saying the system functioned like that and that way their was less centralisation of power in the hands of few.
I, personally, don't really care about voting. As long as I have Kildare.

It functioned like that in Kildare and, to some extent, in Elwynn. But the Brookshire duke was never really dependent on the Kehl, nor the Straylightian or Yardistani dukes.

Kaiseress Anandja II wrote:It functioned like that in Kildare and, to some extent, in Elwynn. But the Brookshire duke was never really dependent on the Kehl, nor the Straylightian or Yardistani dukes.

Not my fault you guys weren't organised enough.

Just joking, wasn't this topic about 'counties'? I still prefer Counts!

Now that is undoubtedly Aster's best post this month.

Agreed.

I'm still trying to get Nick to get back to me... He doesn't love me anymore.

I'm still trying to get Nick to get back to me... He doesn't love me anymore.

Because you eviscerated Yardistan, maybe?

JAke.. stfu. Nick doesn't care about what we do here anymore. Don't try to use my bestfriend as a weapon against me.

James thought the House system was a Great idea when I explained it all.

Erik Mortis wrote:J
James thought the House system was a Great idea when I explained it all.

In theory, yes.