My Proposal

[Aurangzeb Khan]

If Kaiser Loki can be prevailed upon to accept the legitimacy of Kaiser Ayreon's claim to the throne under law then might not Kaiser Ayreon be prevailed upon to defer his accession until September 15th 2008 as a fair and just acknowledgement of the pact which previously promised the throne to Jacobus Loki at the end of the reign of Kaiser Hasan?

Is this not fair? If it is, I would call upon the Gods and the Dukes to endorse this settlement.

[Ari Rahikkala]

What, *another* "I'll be the Kaiser now and you'll get the throne later" deal? Did you by any chance check out what got us into this situation in the first place?

[Hesam Jayatar]

Yeah I don't really like this, because jacobus acknowledging that Kaiser Ayreon is the legitimate holder of the Throne, only means that Jacobus is acknowledging his treason in open view without shame.

[Jonas]

The most fair was that Jacobus stayed the legal and rightful successor. We can of course make this deal and do the same what Hasan did, but I know Kaiser Loki II would never do that!

[Aurangzeb Khan]

Ari, after the fuss that came with the violating of this one - I am sure that more sensible heads will prevail upon the accession of Ayreon.

[Kaiser Loki II]

The problem with the last accession is that it was an understanding among gentlemen, one of which turned out to be nothing of the sort.

Jonas is right. If I give my word, I will keep it. That is why I seldom make ironclad promises.

I am prepared to discuss this further, perhaps with alterations. Let's here from some more of the people.

[Aurangzeb Khan]

This uprising, if nothing else, has proved the reason why gentleman's agreements and constitutional conventions need to be observed even when they are not the codified letter of the law.


(OOC: This is great fun btw, Shireroth is pretty much the closest micronationalism gets to the sort of scheming that used to go on in royal courts during the Renaissance, you don't get that elsewhere.)

[Hesam Jayatar]

Now, speaking completely hypothetically, (which, as loyal subjects of course we are), should the great Hasan unfortunately join his long-fathers (Gods Forbid!), and should a Kaiser Loki find his way to the Golden Mango Throne, then those of talent and ability would be rewarded.

A gentlemens agreement like this one Jacobus?

[Malliki]

So that is what you're basing your claims that Kaiser Loki wants a new Duke of Elwynn on? Flimsy at best.

[b3n|<3r|\|]

Sanest thing anyone's said since this madness began Ardashir.

[Kaiser Loki II]

Kaiser's should always reward those of ability and loyalty. Rewards were not spelled out.

Somewhere in there I also expressed my confidence in Ardy as MoMa.

[Malliki]

YOU CONNIVING SON OF A... Wait. That's actually nice. Hmmm...

[Scott of Hyperborea]

I don't like these "so and so gets to be Kaiser next" deals. If other people have aspirations for the Kaisership, it unfairly penalizes them because they didn't declare this time around. And it would be a really bad idea to start a tradition of "the guy who loses the inheritance battle this time is automatically promised the Kaisership the next time", because that would just encourage people who weren't capable/ready of the Kaisership to make a go for it.

It's also contrary to the spirit of winner-takes-all rebellion, civil war, and chaos that has made the last few succession battles so enjoyable.

[Erik Mortis]

Yeah.. a lot more fun then me just taking the throne...

[Hesam Jayatar]

I figure that so long as Jacobus and I are citizens, each succession will be as interesting.

[Erik Mortis]

I'm happy as Arbiter. It's the job I was born for.

[Kaiser Loki II]

I figure that so long as Jacobus and I are citizens, each succession will be as interesting.

Actually, after my reign is over (most likely in September), I was going to semi-retire. Not leave, just take a county or a Barony, do some writing, MN travel, that kind of thing.

[hypatias mom]

Whatever happened to arresting and convicting the murdering so-and-so who killed our dear Kaiser? He is at least responsible for the mess in which we currently find ourselves, and at most guilty of high treason. If Ardashir benefits from this foul deed and goes unpunished, the rule of law here in Shireroth has come to be worth nothing. If any were in league with him in this, they also should be punished. We don't have the ability to execute traitors, but we can banish them from the realm. There should be no profit in a crime of this magnitude.

And if Kaiser Hasan's will specified someone other than the one agreed upon, his reasoning should be respected, and should not be put down to some unspecified "mental illness." I think the word of the Kaiser remains law, and should not be abrogated. At this point, I don't think that just jumping up and saying, "I have the crown," while contravening the will of the late Kaiser, is a valid assertion. If the Kaiser's will stated RIc to be the heir, he is the legal heir, and should be respected and acclaimed as such.

I realize that an opposing agreement was entered into months ago to resolve the last succession crisis. However, Hasan had serious reasons for changing this succession. I believe we should honor his last will and testament.

[Malliki]

Bla bla bla rule of law bla bla bla bla...

[Kaiser Loki II]

Sorry to loose you, Carol.

This is essentially RPG. Hasan knew bloody well what he was walking into. He orchestrated it, at least in part.

Please note that nobody is really dead. hasan is using this to twist the empire - Again.

We can thank him for helping up the post count, and send him on his way.

[hypatias mom]

(OOC--Jacobus, I am well aware this is an RPG. And in that RPG, Hasan's ghost asked me to speak on his and Ric's behalf. Since we all saw Ardy shoot Hasan multiple times, it is obvious he did not commit suicide. If Hasan believed you were involved in the plot, it smacks of Hamlet's situation--the ghost asking to be avenged. I am taking this as seriously in RL as the Sightseers War. When this is all resolved, we will still be friends, I trust. And, yes, this is a lot of fun, and not to be taken as seriously as my words suggested. However, I think all sides still need to work out the solution.)

[Hesam Jayatar]

OOC: I just thought a Shakespearean drama was an appropriate end to my reign as Kaiser. I'm glad people are picking up on the fact. Atleast I think its terribly entertaining.

[Kaiser Loki II]

And the post count looks GREAT!

Nobody can generate activity like Hasan and Jacobus at each others throats .

[Hesam Jayatar]

Well said, you cyberian carpetbagger! lol

[Kaiser Loki II]

Our ethnic group just doubled in size! Tremble with Fear!

[Jonas]

My Dutchy is active, and saved from Jacobus and Hassan bickering.

[Kaiser Loki II]

We could bicker over there, but you have such nice pictures.

BTW, if they aren't on the wiki, can you save them there?

[Jonas]

We could bicker over there, but you have such nice pictures.

BTW, if they aren't on the wiki, can you save them there?

I could save them... yes...

[Kaiser Loki II]

Huzzah!

[Liam conToketi]

My Dutchy is active, and saved from Jacobus and Hassan bickering.

Instead you get Jess and Ric