On Lac Glacei

[Kaiseress Semisa I]

Since, Duke Andelarion, you are already vociferous on the matter and are citizen to both sides of the issue, I will leave it to you to settle the dispute, with the aid of the Minstry of the Exterior, unless the Grand Commonwealth chooses to send another advocate.I do, however, think your plan is acceptable, as the land remains within Shirithian holdings.

[UEC]

Here's the thing on La Glacia.... We never relinguished our claims to it. We took it off the map, as a favor to the MCS (under Aure....), because they were complaining we were to big. But we never reliquished out claim. Than WV claimed it was his... cause we reliquished our claim. IE.. La Glacia was never not ours.. thus no one BUT us has legit claim to it. So... my oppinion is there is NOTHING to negotiate.. this is just a mess WV created... He never had a legit claim to it. It is, and always has been ours.... (ever since we first claimed it many years ago). the GC is just looking for more land. There is NO issue here. E. Metzler (UEC)Duke of Brookshire"Never use a BOO/\/\ist as a diplomat" -- GSClicky Clicky..., Tiss for your own good ya know.

[RicLyon]

My Lady,I will undertake your wishes and report to you over PM how negotiations are proceeding. Erik,The thing is that a few treaties between Shireroth and Treesia made Lac Glacei "shared"... Richard LyonYansha Elaer Kyon gef ShanPernem kahn gef kuymal per varga stiPernem kahn gef varga per kuymal sti

[UEC]

That was because Ryan kept yelling and bitching it was his.And those treaties if I recall state that if one nation dies, the land goes to the other completely.. Treesia died.. the treaty stated the land went to us. End of story. This is just land grabbing, we don't need to... and shouldn't be negotiating for land they have no legal right too in the first place. E. Metzler (UEC)Duke of Brookshire"Never use a BOO/\/\ist as a diplomat" -- GSClicky Clicky..., Tiss for your own good ya know.

[RicLyon]

If that is the case, Erik, the negotiations will aim for having Treesia relinquish its claim on Lac Glacei.Having a foreign nation claim our territory could prove difficult, especially if the GC starts lobbying other governments to acknowledge Treesian/GC sovereignty over Lac Glacei.I just don't like unresolved disputes.

[UEC]

Than if they do that we lobby too, and if need by declare hostilities for violating the treaty we have with them to recognize each other's lands, and for claiming our lands and trying to get other nations to recognize them too. E. Metzler (UEC)Duke of Brookshire"Never use a BOO/\/\ist as a diplomat" -- GSClicky Clicky..., Tiss for your own good ya know.

[RicLyon]

Creating divisions is not the preferred solution when trying to thaw the relations with the Grand Commonwealth.

[UEC]

well.. I never took kindly to people claiming our lands.. we've had to deal with it enough I'm of the oppinion... fry the fuckers.. E. Metzler (UEC)Duke of Brookshire"Never use a BOO/\/\ist as a diplomat" -- GSClicky Clicky..., Tiss for your own good ya know.

[Krasniy Yastreb]

One does not simply "fry" the GC...

[RicLyon]

My dear Lady Kaiseress, Ruler of Shireroth:Recently discussions on the status of Lac Glacei have been emerging. While Shireroth maintains that Lac Glacei is Shirerithian, and solely so, the Grand Commonwealth has a claim to Lac Glacei.Although not the same as the Lorelei situation, the Lac Glacei issue seems to be troublesome. I do not fear relations between Shireroth and the Grand Commonwealth to be severed because of this. Lac Glacei at the moment has a Treesian majority who seem loyal to Shireroth.I would, however, urge you to to engage in direct negotiations with the Taoiseach of the Grand Commonwealth and with the Government of the Sovereign Order of Treesia so that the dispute can be settled.Personally I would recommend a solution in something like this:- Shireroth exercises sovereignty over Lac Glacei- Lac Glacei is demilitarized- A Treesian culture shall be maintained and protected and may not be infringed upon.Much like how the Ã…land dispute between Finland and Sweden was settled.*bows*

[Ryan]

My claim is semi-legit on Lac Glacei since;a. Jacobus, LG's founder, declared it mineandb. Because I put a lot of effort into the independent projecthttp://www.geocities.com/lacglacei/Though I still say that if you wanted to reduce the land and keep the territory, you should've not removed it entirely from the map and simply relocated on the southern or eastern shores. But instead you chose to remove it all. Name. Borders. Cities. Everything.Now half the damn microworld agrees with me in thinking that looks an awful lot like Shireroth abandoned it. That's the only reason I tried to do something with it. I really wish you'd stop saying I was trying to start shit, cause I wasn't. I'm getting sick and tired of you trying to paint up my misunderstanding of something like I'm sort of evil conspirator. I misunderstood. Bottom line. The only reason I pressed the claim is because Shireroth did jack all with it until I tried to claim it, after the fact that I had put a lot of work into it.I dunno where these claims from the GC are coming from. Although I never relinquished my claim on LG, I've pretty much just let it slide as I'm not in the mood to bitch about it. I have enough people to bitch with at the MCS. Useless art is simply tolerated vandalism. I am a vandal.

[UEC]

....ok.. you listened to Jacobus.. that's just mistake one..heheheIf you didn't want to start something.. you wouldn't have continued when we reminded you it was ours.. and would have just made up something new.... E. Metzler (UEC)Duke of Brookshire"Never use a BOO/\/\ist as a diplomat" -- GSClicky Clicky..., Tiss for your own good ya know.

[Ryan]

The majority of the work was done when you showed up to re-assert Shirerithian authority.If someone came and said to you to throw away a weeks worth of work just so they could have a tiny scrap of land which they've done nothing with, I think you'd have opposed it too. Useless art is simply tolerated vandalism. I am a vandal.

[david northworthy beckfor]

Frm the Northfloating treatyQuote:ARTICLE NINE: Should either nation withdraw unilaterally from this treaty or collapse, Lac Glacei will revert fully to the control of the other.Quote:ARTICLE SIX: Both Shireroth and Treesia affirm that Ryan Caruso has no claim whatsoever to Lac Glacei; he is, however, invited to remain in the territory as a cultural advisor and Grand Duke Emeritus, with all the honor this title may accord. If you feel an icy chill...the Conglacio is amongst you

[RicLyon]

I am sure, Ryan, that your title of "Grand Duke of Lac Glacei" will remain.Legally speaking you are still the Grand Duke

[Ryan]

No offense, but it's a worthless title when you can't do anything with it. I may be Grand Duke Emeritus, but I have no power to institute my concepts and ideas for Lac Glacei. I can only suggest them. Which doesn't give me much incentive to bother making the effort.On a side thought, I'd be willing to trade sovereignity over Greater Automatica for Lac Glacei. Useless art is simply tolerated vandalism. I am a vandal.

[Kaiseress Semisa I]

And where is Greater Automatica?

[RicLyon]

Just west of Elwynn.

[RicLyon]

And sorry Ryan, but neither Treaty mentions you.Instead "Eoin Dornan" (who's that ) is made Grand Duke...

[Ryan]

Which treaty are you referring to? The one for Lac Glacei or the one for Greater Automatica? Useless art is simply tolerated vandalism. I am a vandal.

[Scott of Hyperborea]

Ryan, you IIRC gave your share of control to Treesia back in the day. Treesia contested it with us, we signed the Treaty of Northfloating to share it, and the Treaty contained a provision that if either of us collapsed, it would revert to the other; Treesia did collapse, and it reverts to us. Last time I talked to Iain he hoped to challenge that based on lack of anyone having the treaty, but David seems to have kept records assiduously enough that that will not be necessary.

[UEC]

it should be reposted.But I know that clause is in there cause I remember having something to say on that matter... E. Metzler (UEC)Duke of Brookshire"Never use a BOO/\/\ist as a diplomat" -- GSClicky Clicky..., Tiss for your own good ya know.

[RicLyon]

Update:Negotiations with Treesia are ungoing.The Kaiseress and the Leader of Treesia have agreed to have the matter referred to a neutral arbitrator to rule on the status of the treaty.Both the Kaiseress and the Treesian leader, without talking to each other, suggested Rob Davis to be the arbitrator. We await his reply.

[UEC]

Who's he? And from where? E. Metzler (UEC)Duke of Brookshire"Never use a BOO/\/\ist as a diplomat" -- GSClicky Clicky..., Tiss for your own good ya know.

[RicLyon]

He?If you mean "he" as the leader of Treesia, that's Iain de Vembria.The other "he", Rob Davis, is the head of UAI, a intermicronational legal services company, and is renowned for his impartiality and legal professionalism. Richard LyonYansha Elaer Kyon gef ShanPernem kahn gef kuymal per varga stiPernem kahn gef varga per kuymal sti

[david northworthy beckfor]

Northfloating Treaty If you feel an icy chill...the Conglacio is amongst you

[Osman Shahanshah]

Might I point out that Treesia never agreed to or ratified Northfloating. It instead passed SouthsailingAs neither party agreed to either treaty neither treaty is valid. Therefore Treesia and by extension the Grand Commonwealth returns to the previous position of claiming full sovereignty over Lac Glacei, specifically as set out by the Occidental Agreement. The arguement that Treesia forfitted Lac Glacei because of the interegnum between the end of the barony and the rise of the Sovereign Order is null and void therefore we assert our total right to the territory in question. We are confident that mediation will resolve the matter in the Commonwealth's favour and that any attempt by Shireroth to contest the result of mediation would be a big mistake.

[RicLyon]

That certainly helps in the upcoming negotiations...Perhaps we will have to consider shared sovereignty then...

[Master R Davis]

Nobody has approached me to mediate this dispute. I have no email, no PM, etc. If someone has tried to contact me, I apologise for the delay but the message was not received. I would appreciate it if someone would send me an email and let me know how I can be of service: UAI@cableone.net Thanks WEBSITE

[Scott of Hyperborea]

May I point out that the Treaty of Southsailing contains the very same language in its Article Nine? Edited by: Scott of Hyperborea  at: 11/27/05 14:24