So... Open Season on Kildare?

[Harvey Steffke]

House Kildare has revoked their loyalty to the crown over the Aster banning. As Erik, our house's head, has stated that we will defend and honor the banning, and he has also said that if we're gunna do turf wars we should do it together, should we show House Kildare the cost of their lack of respect?

I say House Kildare instead of Jonas despite Jonas's cries that this is a "personal decision" because Jonas leads the house and a personal decision he makes of this nature affects the entire house. If innocent people get caught in the crossfire of the turf war, that encourages them to adopt a house head that is going to show a bit more loyalty to the crown and a bit more prudence in what ha declares.

[Erik Mortis]

I support this move. Shall we have a goal? Or just go in 'guns' a blazing? Maybe we can capture their capital or something. Then get some land out of it.

[Jacobus Loki]

This from someone who kept a rebellion going through how many reigns?

.....and there have been no posts in Monty Cristo since October of 2009. Time to reclaim?

[Erik Mortis]

4 Reigns. And I admit it was a bad move on my part. At best a running joke.

I've been busy with other nationally productive affairs.



So, shall we focus our forces on taking Apollonia?

[Harvey Steffke]

Yeah.

How we gunna do this? I assume you don't want any sort of points-based recwar system. Maybe just freestyle it?

[Erik Mortis]

We could freestyle it.. it's the old fashion way to do it. More fun to. We have more people, so we got numerical superiority.

[Shyriath]

Freestyle recwar? Really??

AT.

FRICKIN'.

LAST.

If you wanna do this, my Duke, the ships of Sunderspray will be at your disposal... troop transport, harassment of enemy shipping, looting and sacking coastal targets, name yer poison.

[Shyriath]

Also, potential bonus points: if the sphere of influence thing goes ahead fast enough, maybe we could get in on it in conjunction with a recwar agaist Kildare itself?

Consider this: House Mortis will have to protect its interests in Apollonia now, right? And even though Kildare proper is shrunk from the Duchy days, some of the other counties may still harbor Kildari sympathies, and coastal counties in particular would be too valuable in the naval campaigns to be allowed to slide. Mortis could occupy some key ports and try to win over their sympathies, maybe? And observant military personnel participating in those missions could "discover" a lot about the cultures they find over there...

[Jacobus Loki]

Friendly advice.

Don't do it.

You would be uncorking a djinn that you will never be able to put back in the bottle again.

[Erik Mortis]

What Time era shall we go for?
Sail and Sword?
Or Fire and Steal?
Or Steam and Cannon?
Or 8 inch Guns and machine guns...

I like the idea of old style tech... seems more personable and not just a Who Knows about the Latest Tech contest.

Monty Crisco could field a battalion of Archers like in the good days. Flying the Banner of Mortis. TO VICTORY!

[Harvey Steffke]

Jake, it's happening. Perhaps you could better spend your energy talking about parameters you approve of rather than making vague threats?

[Erik Mortis]

And I wouldn't expect much help from the courts. Win, we appeal to the Kaiseress. Lose, you have to Appeal to the Kaiseress. I don't see her looking to kindly on your case when you Dutch is in rebellion.

[Jacobus Loki]

Jake, it's happening. Perhaps you could better spend your energy talking about parameters you approve of rather than making vague threats?

I do not approve, period.

It is for the Dutch to speak of such, should he care to.

But setting Shirithian against Shirithian in this fashion, you may very well bring the roof down on all of our heads.

[Shyriath]

What Time era shall we go for?
Sail and Sword?
Or Fire and Steal?
Or Steam and Cannon?
Or 8 inch Guns and machine guns...

I'd prefer older tech as well, but maybe late enough to include cannon? I had been thinking your classical pirate ships... 17th century or so. But by that time firearms were in widespread use, so your archers might be out of place...

[Andreas the Wise]

Look guys, I'll be blunt and OOC. A recwar would be fun and all, but I'm in the middle of studying for exams and am spending too much time on micronations as it is. I cannot possibly justify a recwar at the moment. I've asked Jonas to step down and cease arguing if he cannot remain loyal to the throne. I ask that you accept this and don't be bastards about it. I should hope you're well aware that you've already conflated this issue beyond what was actually said*. You know that recwar is no fun if you don't have people to fight against. If you won't do it out of any personal respect to Jonas and Jacobus, then do it out of respect for Corey and I**.


* Never did Jonas ask for rebellion against the Kaiseress, nor say that Kildare should. He merely said that he has personal issues with remaining loyal to her; asked our advice; and concluded that he cannot remain loyal to her. You didn't even give Corey or I a chance to suggest what implications this would have for his position as head.

** It's not often we agree on an issue, and it would be nice if we had the chance to do it more often.

[Shyriath]

Aw, pooh.

When put like that, though... My Duke, since Andreas was good enough to ask Jonas to step down, perhaps we can postpone the invasion to a more recwar-friendly time?

[Erik Mortis]

Yeah... I'm so inclined.... But I still want my war....

Andreas, when would you be free again for us to invade you?

And Jake.... You set SHirerithian against Shirerithna all the time... it's a hobby for you.. Shit.. I'm late for owkr.

[Falkner van der Sluijs]

If you won't do it out of any personal respect to Jonas and Jacobus, then do it out of respect for Corey and I**.

** It's not often we agree on an issue, and it would be nice if we had the chance to do it more often.

^^This

Because I'm still loyal to the crown anyway, despite Jonas's opinion on the matter. I swore loyalty to him, but he didn't really upkeep his end of the bargain, so I'm a bit on my own here.

[Erik Mortis]

Which bargain?

[Falkner van der Sluijs]

That whole "Oath to Kildare" thing?

[Erik Mortis]

I'm still lacking on details...

[Andreas the Wise]

Andreas, when would you be free again for us to invade you?

I agree that this would be a great motivator for cultural development for Kildare and so would be good for us. If we started (like, actually started having interactions, not started negotiating settings or sending ships on 3 day journeys) next Thursday, I could participate for two weeks. I'm still going to be away for two and a half weeks after that, but I suspect you're not keen on delaying the war six weeks.

I would also like, in the meantime, you guys to specify what is appropriate/not appropriate in free form. In a clear way that assumes I haven't recwarred with you before, because for most of you, I haven't. At the moment, I would read freeform as "troop sizes determined by what is story realistic/previously established**; paramaters for appropriate actions are story-realistic***, not real world realistic (ie no wikipedia surfing required); and the whole thing is going to totally break down if both sides want to seriously win*."
* because there's not proper way to resolve battles except by mutual agreement, we don't even have comparative force sizes and reality to go off like under Anunia.
** and this is going to include wrestling giant felines in Kitanus Fields; the Ocean Palace with 12 Typhoon class submarines; being shot at by Dryads in Old Hallucination; fighting Halluci armies in Old Hallucination; at least one Kraken in the River Antya; lightning-flinging Djinii from Gong Li; mages and probably some weird genetic experiments from Raynor Isles; pirates from Norfolk; air pirates from Glanurchy (that's in Gralus, but hey, Mel'Kat started life as a Shirithian character); and melangians recording history; and maybe several gods ...
*** I'll try and restrict magic to CCM appropriate levels, though not actually using CCM, since Gralans are between magic systems atm and no one else has ever really had a recwar magic system afaik.


My preference would be for 17th century type weapons, maybe 18th. The time when swords are still valid; guns work but aren't great; cannons on wooden ships are all the rage; and of course, mages and magical creatures.

Yeah, not sure if you really want to freestyle me ...

[Kaiseress Anandja II]

*Eats popcorn while waiting for Erik to comment on magicks*

[Harvey Steffke]

At the moment, I would read freeform as "troop sizes determined by what is story realistic/previously established*

To a point. One person fighting four people in a recwar should have roughly 1/4 the strength. Now it can be weird, exotic strength that may be difficult to counter, and if they have sufficient storyline background they might end up with unusually large numbers that could be maybe up to 1/3 the strength, but it should still be a relatively hopeless battle as far as sheer numbers went (of course, if you can think of tactics that even the scores, that's another matter, but I'm talking fair fights here). So even though you don't have to cost things they should still be sort of kind of even unless you have really good reasons why.

And I know for a fact that those 12 Typhoons are 1) really really old and 2) slave wired to defending the Ocean Palace only. You can't command them in battle. The only real use they would be to you would be if enemies wandered in the vicinity of the Ocean Palace (underwater, as they wouldn't attack surface vessels) and they swarm attacked due to their programming. Nice try though!

[Andreas the Wise]

So if you need roughly equal strength based on people, what's the point of not doing it points based?

[Harvey Steffke]

Because you shouldn't have to.

The point of freeform recwar isn't to say "I control X amount of land and there are such and such forces in it. I command all of it for the purpose of the war game." No, the idea is more like, "Okay, I'm going to take some of my forces and throw them at your forces. Let's have a clean fight." And if one side starts winning badly, sure, the losing side can dig up some reinforcements or a superweapon or something. The goal is to have fun without either needing to constrain oneself with rules or completely plowing the opposition over.

[Andreas the Wise]

Hmm ... that's an interesting reinforcement idea.

But I meant more in the context of avoiding disputes. If you all agree the result beforehand, sure, I can see how you don't need points. But if both sides want to win, and a dispute over how the battle goes emerges, points at least allow you to fall back on "Well, my force is double the strength of your force so I should be doing better."

[Harvey Steffke]

You can still do that in freestyle. If I have 100 men and you have 200, and you're not winning as handily as you think you should and I'm not coming up with anything all that clever to justify why I'm not losing badly, you can still call me on it.

I do think it's worth trying though (after your exams, obviously) just because we haven't done freestyle in oh so long. And if it goes badly then it goes badly and we move on. Wouldn't be the first time a recwar had turned a bit sour.

[Jonas]

No recwar?

You can still invade me... we will start a guarilla in Apollo City! You will get lost in all those streets! MUHAHJAHA!

[Shyriath]

Just postponed, just postponed. I yearn for a recwar too, but let's not leave Andreas out before he's ready. Savor the anticipation; I know I will.

*Quietly ponders showing Mortis claim-colors on Kildari lands when he gets to that point in the map*