I should join a gym...
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I should join a gym...
I HATE MY APARTMENT BUILDING. I live on campus :-P
Well... I don't mind the girls who live here. Either they're exchange students, or nice good-looking Swedish girls who smile and say hello to you when they pass.... But the guys. Well, they don't look half-bad either, and that's the problem. I am nothing compared to them! Since a majority of them belong to the police academy they are tall, muscular and broad-shouldered.
Me... I am 176 cm with 55 kg, I'm rather small compared to them. I say "hi" to them, and I have to look up three metres to see their faces. But they smile and say hello anyway. Ah well. BUT I FEEL SMALL AND INSIGNIFICANT!
So... I should gain some 20 kg to get myself a nice build. Shame I can't do anything about the height.
Well... I don't mind the girls who live here. Either they're exchange students, or nice good-looking Swedish girls who smile and say hello to you when they pass.... But the guys. Well, they don't look half-bad either, and that's the problem. I am nothing compared to them! Since a majority of them belong to the police academy they are tall, muscular and broad-shouldered.
Me... I am 176 cm with 55 kg, I'm rather small compared to them. I say "hi" to them, and I have to look up three metres to see their faces. But they smile and say hello anyway. Ah well. BUT I FEEL SMALL AND INSIGNIFICANT!
So... I should gain some 20 kg to get myself a nice build. Shame I can't do anything about the height.
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Re: I should join a gym...
Who are you???
Re: I should join a gym...
Ric?
From a distance I'm concerned about the rampant lawyerism manifesting itself in Shireroth currently. A simple Kaiserial slap on the wrist or censure by the community should suffice. - Jacobus Loki
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Can't you see? I'm crazy!
- Icebreaker
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Re: I should join a gym...
THE FUCK? I COULD PROBABLY EAT YOU!Rai Avon-El wrote:Me... I am 176 cm with 55 kg...
- hypatias mom
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Re: I should join a gym...
Hi, Ric--
I'm afraid we're all stuck at the height our genes have selected for us. But, yes, it is possible to build a stronger body by eating properly and careful exercise. Don't think, though, that you're the only one to feel your body doesn't measure up when compared to those physical specimens you see around campus. This has been happening as long as people have looked at others as possible competition. Exercise increases endorphins, and we can all use more of those. Hope your new plan goes well.
Oh, yes. My son was sure he'd be tall like his dad, and was disappointed to stop growing at 5'6", only to be passed up by his sister, who grew to over 5'8"! His favorite line to her during that time was, "Will you shrink?!"
.
I'm afraid we're all stuck at the height our genes have selected for us. But, yes, it is possible to build a stronger body by eating properly and careful exercise. Don't think, though, that you're the only one to feel your body doesn't measure up when compared to those physical specimens you see around campus. This has been happening as long as people have looked at others as possible competition. Exercise increases endorphins, and we can all use more of those. Hope your new plan goes well.
Oh, yes. My son was sure he'd be tall like his dad, and was disappointed to stop growing at 5'6", only to be passed up by his sister, who grew to over 5'8"! His favorite line to her during that time was, "Will you shrink?!"
.
Last edited by hypatias mom on Wed Sep 10, 2008 7:51 am, edited 2 times in total.
- b3n|<3r|\|
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Re: I should join a gym...
You might be small, but that doesn't make you insignificant. In any case, be happy you don't have trouble reaching door knobs, or often hit your head on buses and stairs.
Vilhelm von Benkern - The Dolphin-...Count
:: Formerly just "benkern"
:: Rook Sentry of the Order of the Vorpal Blade
:: Count of Mar Sara IIRC
:: Former Baron of Absentia AFAIK, before that Baron of Vorpmadal TBH; also Former Duke of Yardistan IMHO
:: Dux Emeritus of the Order of Mischievous Intent
It takes moo to mango!
:: Formerly just "benkern"
:: Rook Sentry of the Order of the Vorpal Blade
:: Count of Mar Sara IIRC
:: Former Baron of Absentia AFAIK, before that Baron of Vorpmadal TBH; also Former Duke of Yardistan IMHO
:: Dux Emeritus of the Order of Mischievous Intent
It takes moo to mango!
- Ari Rahikkala
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Re: I should join a gym...
Pah, bus doors and stairs. You learn to always pay attention to those. No, the real problem is when you put on your winter shoes with their thick soles and suddenly the doorframes in your own flat go down to just the right height to smack you on the skull. I speak from experience .
No-one should be without a parasol, Sirocco.
Re: I should join a gym...
Pfff. Churchill didn't sport and became old... and famous!
From a distance I'm concerned about the rampant lawyerism manifesting itself in Shireroth currently. A simple Kaiserial slap on the wrist or censure by the community should suffice. - Jacobus Loki
Can't you see? I'm crazy!
Can't you see? I'm crazy!
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Re: I should join a gym...
*shrug*
I liked when I was shorter. It's easier to move around. Now I'm taller and heavier and slower, less nimble.
I liked when I was shorter. It's easier to move around. Now I'm taller and heavier and slower, less nimble.
Oroigawa Koreyasu
Count of McCallavre, Straylight
Count of Lesser Attera, Kildare
Count of Asantelian, Brookshire
Chairman, Senate of the Lakes, Hurmu
Count of McCallavre, Straylight
Count of Lesser Attera, Kildare
Count of Asantelian, Brookshire
Chairman, Senate of the Lakes, Hurmu
- Scott of Hyperborea
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Re: I should join a gym...
I haven't gotten a "OMG I need to become muscular and good-looking!" impulse for a few years now, but I have this site bookmarked on my computer as what I'm going to use if I ever do. You're welcome to test it out for me.
Re: I should join a gym...
Me... I am 176 cm with 55 kg,
176 cm?.. wait? If my converter is correct in saying thats around 5 foot 7 you must have some damned tall girls and guys on your campus. I mean, here (UK), yeah some guys are about 6'0" or so.. but about 5'7" is normal for girls (a little higher for guys, but not much really -between 5'7" and 6'4").
But still, don't let it get you down like.. you shouldn't mind too much what you look like, people should respect you no matter how tall/small/thin/fat you look. Even if you do think you differ from everyone else, really they're all thinking as you are about themselves.. people are never happy
I also think that people shouldn't care too much for what their partners looks like, well ok so to a certain degree.. but personality and how they are "inside" should be top of the list.
- Scott of Hyperborea
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Re: I should join a gym...
"Should" and a dollar will buy you a cup of coffee (two dollars if you live in the Eurozone).People should respect you no matter how tall/small/thin/fat you look...I also think that people shouldn't care too much for what their partners looks like
Re: I should join a gym...
I'm maybe 2 cm taller and 5 kg heavier than you, and have no problems with it, personally.
(Note - 176 cm is closer to 5'10'' than 5'7''. Remember, 12 inches in a foot, not 10. 5.7 feet becomes 5'10'' or so. Stupid Imperial.)
(Note - 176 cm is closer to 5'10'' than 5'7''. Remember, 12 inches in a foot, not 10. 5.7 feet becomes 5'10'' or so. Stupid Imperial.)
Bayen ronToketi
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Count of Backbone Site
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Re: I should join a gym...
Ben, you and I are about 180cm. As for weight, I'll let you figure that out for yourself, but I'm around 65-70kg.
Anyway, whenever you get back to this thread, Ric, you're a bit shorter and a bit lighter than me (well, ok, it's like 10-15kg/20-30lbs, but evs), and I'm a tad above average compared to most guys I know. You're doing alright, don't go overboard on exercise if you choose to go that route. Low self-esteem leads to really bad things. But absolutely work out, it's healthy. If you can get into martial arts, it's very fun!
Anyway, whenever you get back to this thread, Ric, you're a bit shorter and a bit lighter than me (well, ok, it's like 10-15kg/20-30lbs, but evs), and I'm a tad above average compared to most guys I know. You're doing alright, don't go overboard on exercise if you choose to go that route. Low self-esteem leads to really bad things. But absolutely work out, it's healthy. If you can get into martial arts, it's very fun!
Oroigawa Koreyasu
Count of McCallavre, Straylight
Count of Lesser Attera, Kildare
Count of Asantelian, Brookshire
Chairman, Senate of the Lakes, Hurmu
Count of McCallavre, Straylight
Count of Lesser Attera, Kildare
Count of Asantelian, Brookshire
Chairman, Senate of the Lakes, Hurmu
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Re: I should join a gym...
Hugs all around! Except for you. NO HUGS FOR YOU!
What follows has lead me to this place where I belong, with all erased.
- Demon of the North
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Re: I should join a gym...
awwww
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Re: I should join a gym...
No, not you, the other you!
What follows has lead me to this place where I belong, with all erased.
- Gman Russell
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Re: I should join a gym...
*Sigh*
NO! How many other you's are there?!
NO! How many other you's are there?!
What follows has lead me to this place where I belong, with all erased.
- Oroigawa Koreyasu
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Re: I should join a gym...
Hi. o/
Oroigawa Koreyasu
Count of McCallavre, Straylight
Count of Lesser Attera, Kildare
Count of Asantelian, Brookshire
Chairman, Senate of the Lakes, Hurmu
Count of McCallavre, Straylight
Count of Lesser Attera, Kildare
Count of Asantelian, Brookshire
Chairman, Senate of the Lakes, Hurmu
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Re: I should join a gym...
Hi.
What follows has lead me to this place where I belong, with all erased.
- Ari Rahikkala
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Re: I should join a gym...
http://omploader.org/vcXhp/Three_of_me_ ... e_else.oggGman Russell wrote:*Sigh*
NO! How many other you's are there?!
No-one should be without a parasol, Sirocco.
Re: I should join a gym...
No, not you, the other you!
.. who?
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Re: I should join a gym...
(sorry about this one... there isn't any insight in this post that smarter minds haven't already been thinking of for several man-years. I just wrote it for a different forum after a little argument on IRC over whether killing an exact clone of oneself is morally wrong, and it seemed poetically appropriate to copy over here...)
Oh no! You've just caught Dennett's disease (*)! This syndrome causes in its sufferers a debilitating doubt about one's personal identity, including constant questioning of whether you are the same person when you wake up in the morning as you were when you went to sleep, and time wasted pondering whether you'd notice it if every particle in your body was simultaneously swapped out and replaced with a different one with exactly the same identifying characteristics (location, speed, particle type, etc). Untreated, it eventually leads to complete mental deadlock.
Fortunately, there is a cure: To shock you with an even greater reason to doubt your identity! Unfortunately, the development of medicine and psychology has not yet produced a technique to produce this shock directly. Fortunately, physicists have recently unveiled the Duplication Machine, which as the name says is able to produce an exact duplicate of any object, particle by particle.
The treatment, then, is as simple as this: You are anaesthetised and put in the duplication machine. The machine turns you into you and a perfect duplicate of you, both fast asleep. The duplicate is checked to ensure it's perfectly the same creature as the original, by every imaging technique the doctors have access to. Then, in order to avoid the permanent introduction of a superfluous copy, a fair coin is flpped to decide which of the two should be given a lethal injection. Afterward, the remaining you is woken up, now completely shocked out of the disease.
Your task: Explain what, exactly, has been lost by proceeding with this treatment. If it is an economical or legal reason, just pretend society has simply changed a lot and this treatment is considered right in the future. If it is the potential life the other you could lead, please explain how to justify any action leading to the nonexistence of a creature that could potentially lead a life as rich as the other you. If it's an intrinsic moral principle not related to potential life, please describe that principle.
Extra credit: Oh no! During the clone consistency check, one of you woke up by accident for several seconds. He/she was soon put back to sleep, though, and the procedure went smoothly otherwise. You have no recollection of this occurring, so it seems obvious it was the other you that had those experiences - until the doctors explain that as a standard procedure, patients are given a drug that inhibits the imprinting of memories if they wake up before the designated time. That is, either you had those experiences and forgot, or the other you had those experiences and died, but you can't tell the difference. Investigate the ways in which the difference is important, if any.
(*) I made up the name, Daniel Dennett does work in approximately this area of philosophy, but hasn't actually had a disease named after him - certainly not one like this. Or, rather, he just did, but it's not commonly used in literature
Oh no! You've just caught Dennett's disease (*)! This syndrome causes in its sufferers a debilitating doubt about one's personal identity, including constant questioning of whether you are the same person when you wake up in the morning as you were when you went to sleep, and time wasted pondering whether you'd notice it if every particle in your body was simultaneously swapped out and replaced with a different one with exactly the same identifying characteristics (location, speed, particle type, etc). Untreated, it eventually leads to complete mental deadlock.
Fortunately, there is a cure: To shock you with an even greater reason to doubt your identity! Unfortunately, the development of medicine and psychology has not yet produced a technique to produce this shock directly. Fortunately, physicists have recently unveiled the Duplication Machine, which as the name says is able to produce an exact duplicate of any object, particle by particle.
The treatment, then, is as simple as this: You are anaesthetised and put in the duplication machine. The machine turns you into you and a perfect duplicate of you, both fast asleep. The duplicate is checked to ensure it's perfectly the same creature as the original, by every imaging technique the doctors have access to. Then, in order to avoid the permanent introduction of a superfluous copy, a fair coin is flpped to decide which of the two should be given a lethal injection. Afterward, the remaining you is woken up, now completely shocked out of the disease.
Your task: Explain what, exactly, has been lost by proceeding with this treatment. If it is an economical or legal reason, just pretend society has simply changed a lot and this treatment is considered right in the future. If it is the potential life the other you could lead, please explain how to justify any action leading to the nonexistence of a creature that could potentially lead a life as rich as the other you. If it's an intrinsic moral principle not related to potential life, please describe that principle.
Extra credit: Oh no! During the clone consistency check, one of you woke up by accident for several seconds. He/she was soon put back to sleep, though, and the procedure went smoothly otherwise. You have no recollection of this occurring, so it seems obvious it was the other you that had those experiences - until the doctors explain that as a standard procedure, patients are given a drug that inhibits the imprinting of memories if they wake up before the designated time. That is, either you had those experiences and forgot, or the other you had those experiences and died, but you can't tell the difference. Investigate the ways in which the difference is important, if any.
(*) I made up the name, Daniel Dennett does work in approximately this area of philosophy, but hasn't actually had a disease named after him - certainly not one like this. Or, rather, he just did, but it's not commonly used in literature
No-one should be without a parasol, Sirocco.
- Scott of Hyperborea
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Re: I should join a gym...
Nothing would be lost by the procedure in an objective sense. But if that's all you're talking about, nothing would be lost in an objective sense by killing me and replacing me with some other person who's a better person than I am. An objective sense is a stupid sense to use to deal with a problem about subjectivity. I would personally, subjectively object to being put into the machine. Not because I care about my clone - if he never wakes up, he never achieves status as a moral actor - but I don't want a 50% chance of dying.
The following things seem to me to be wrong with murder: the pain caused incidentally before death, the pain caused to surviving bereaved friends and family, the loss of the benefit the victim could have given the world, and the loss of the future happiness that the victim could have experienced.
In your scenario, two of those are missing. My friends and family wouldn't even have to know I'd been killed since the clone was around, and whatever benefit I could give the world my clone would give just as well. That just leaves pain and the loss of my future happiness.
The actual death wouldn't be painful; you specify that. But the fear of death would be just as bad as fear of death is in any other case. That would create a large amount of unnecessary unhappiness for me.
As for loss of future happiness - you could say it would be exactly counterbalanced by the gain in my clone's future happiness, from the zero of nonexistence up to whatever my future happiness would have been. And that would be true.
But I'm not a perfect utilitarian saint. Tell me you're going to take away 100 utilons from me and give it to some equally deserving person, and my first impulse will still be a reluctance to make the trade and lose utility..
Plus, I don't buy the idea of potential people having moral value. Given that I don't want to die, I might be persuaded to give my life away to save the life of another person based on that person also not wanting to die and having an equal claim to have their wants satisfied. But my clone doesn't care whether he's dead or not until he comes into existence, so I'm not prepared to treat his "want" to come into existence equally to my "want" not to die.
That having been said, my preference for not having the experiment done is a pretty low one. I'd probably be willing to undergo the procedure for maybe $25,000 or so (to go to my clone in the event of my death, of course). But that's probably just because I have a pretty low happiness set point and thoughts of my own death don't bother me as much as they do some people, especially when I know there will be someone else to carry on Scott-ishness.
The following things seem to me to be wrong with murder: the pain caused incidentally before death, the pain caused to surviving bereaved friends and family, the loss of the benefit the victim could have given the world, and the loss of the future happiness that the victim could have experienced.
In your scenario, two of those are missing. My friends and family wouldn't even have to know I'd been killed since the clone was around, and whatever benefit I could give the world my clone would give just as well. That just leaves pain and the loss of my future happiness.
The actual death wouldn't be painful; you specify that. But the fear of death would be just as bad as fear of death is in any other case. That would create a large amount of unnecessary unhappiness for me.
As for loss of future happiness - you could say it would be exactly counterbalanced by the gain in my clone's future happiness, from the zero of nonexistence up to whatever my future happiness would have been. And that would be true.
But I'm not a perfect utilitarian saint. Tell me you're going to take away 100 utilons from me and give it to some equally deserving person, and my first impulse will still be a reluctance to make the trade and lose utility..
Plus, I don't buy the idea of potential people having moral value. Given that I don't want to die, I might be persuaded to give my life away to save the life of another person based on that person also not wanting to die and having an equal claim to have their wants satisfied. But my clone doesn't care whether he's dead or not until he comes into existence, so I'm not prepared to treat his "want" to come into existence equally to my "want" not to die.
That having been said, my preference for not having the experiment done is a pretty low one. I'd probably be willing to undergo the procedure for maybe $25,000 or so (to go to my clone in the event of my death, of course). But that's probably just because I have a pretty low happiness set point and thoughts of my own death don't bother me as much as they do some people, especially when I know there will be someone else to carry on Scott-ishness.
- b3n|<3r|\|
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Re: I should join a gym...
Scottishness. What an unfortunate word... Carol.
Vilhelm von Benkern - The Dolphin-...Count
:: Formerly just "benkern"
:: Rook Sentry of the Order of the Vorpal Blade
:: Count of Mar Sara IIRC
:: Former Baron of Absentia AFAIK, before that Baron of Vorpmadal TBH; also Former Duke of Yardistan IMHO
:: Dux Emeritus of the Order of Mischievous Intent
It takes moo to mango!
:: Formerly just "benkern"
:: Rook Sentry of the Order of the Vorpal Blade
:: Count of Mar Sara IIRC
:: Former Baron of Absentia AFAIK, before that Baron of Vorpmadal TBH; also Former Duke of Yardistan IMHO
:: Dux Emeritus of the Order of Mischievous Intent
It takes moo to mango!
- hypatias mom
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Re: I should join a gym...
Benkern--I really don't think Scott wants to hear my opinion on this hypothetical sitruation or his thought processes which brought him to this conclusion. I like the term Scottishness, and don't particularly feel ownership of it. He has more right, actually possessing that name, to use that phrase to describe those special qualities that make Scott himself and no one else.
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Re: I should join a gym...
It's quite strange how you feel about your body from day to day. When I'm feeling low, then my body becomes grotesque. Otherwise I normally feel it is rather OK despite everything, and... when I'm top of the world, then I actually can look quite good.
- hypatias mom
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Re: I should join a gym...
Actually, I don't find that strange at all. I think most of us view our bodies in relation to how we feel about ourselves.
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